More "Nationality Expertism" on display in Chicago
We’ve actually decided to make “Nationality Expertism” a chapter in the HillBuzz book, cohesively collecting everything we’ve learned about this subject since moving to Chicago in 2005 or so.
For the uninitiated, a “Nationality Expert” is an ass here in Chicago who comes up to one of us in a bar or other social situation and asks some combination of:
* What are you?
* What nationality are you?
* What ethnicity are you?
* Where is your family from?
* Etc.
This only happens to K., Sebastian, and sometimes Joaquin, because they have dark hair (and Joaquin’s mother was a Mexican, so he’s sort of George P. Bush in appearance). It’s never, ever asked of Robby, who is blond and as apple-pie and checkered tablecloths as leftovers from a Tommy Hilfiger photo shoot. Panda’s gaysian, and people just leave it at that, and instead as him “Who are you wearing? Where did you get that hat? How do you do that dance move? How can you get away with saying things like that?”.
“Nationality Expertism” only happens in Chicago, though there was a freak instance of this once back in 2007 when K. did a fundraiser for a little art gallery in Palm Beach, Florida and the ass working the registration table asked him this. Turns out, she grew up in Schaumburg, which is a suburb of, you guessed it, Chicago.
Back in Cleveland, people ask you “Where did you go to high school?” because they want to find out how much money your parents had when you were growing up. If you answered one of the private schools, then they could be friends with you, because you would have come from some money. If you said a public school, they’d make a face and then move on to someone “better” to talk to at the cocktail party.
In New York, Philly, Atlanta, and San Antonio, we’ve found people ask “Where did you go to college?” for the above result. If it’s not a top 50 school, you can forget the friendship. This seems to be a way that jackasses weed out “undesirables”.
In Chicago, it’s all about race for these tools…even when someone is clearly white. There appears to be the “good white”, which is someone who is “from” Great Britain, Ireland, or elsewhere in the British Isles. There’s also “fancy white”, which is someone “from” France, Switzerland, Benilux, the Scandinavian socialist paradises, or scrappy and exotic Iceland (Ooooh! Do you know Bjork?). This means there is “bad white”, or at least, “swarthy white”, and that’s a white person who is “from” anywhere Mediterranian that’s not Italy, or any where that has an -ia at the end of it (like Bulgaria, Romania, Albania, Transylvania, but not Austria, which is more or less a “fancy white”).
As we’ve stated repeatedly, we think this “Nationality Expert” garbage is racist dreck.
We’re all “from” America. Scratch that. We’re FROM America, no quotation marks, because this is where we are from. If you want more specifics, Mr. Census, K. and Bast are from Cleveland. Robby’s from Mineral City. Joaquin’s from San Antonio. Panda’s from a little bit of everywhere, because his parents moved him around every two years or so because of his dad Tico’s work.
If you want to hit on any of us in a bar, without being an ass, why not ask us something about ourselves?
Like these questions:
* What was your Halloween costume last year?
* What’s the last movie you saw in an actual theater?
* Screw movies, what’s the last live theater you saw in an actual theater?
* Are you afraid of puppets?
* Have you ever been to any of the Frank Lloyd Wright houses in Chicago?
* Have you ever been to Christopher Lloyd’s house?
* Did he know you were there at the time?
* How long does it take a restraining order to expire anyway?
* Did you know your name and phone number are written all over the walls in the bathroom, like hundreds of times?
Those are all great first-meet questions.
None of them are racist, unless you have a thing against puppets (if so, sit next to us).
Every so often, someone we have known for a while asks K., Bast, or Joaquin the “Nationality Question” and the rest of us just sit back and watch the fun. This is a different outcome than a first-meet person asking it, because if you are already our friend we’re not going to stop being friends with you over something like this — but you will get admonished for being assy, depending on how far you push this garbage.
Last night, our friend Spence and his manager/photographer was out at Sidetracks, and K. and Panda stopped to say hey. Spence is Chicago’s #1 Laura Branigan impersonator. He’s also America’s ONLY Laura Branigan impersonator, that any of us know of. He does other characters too, like Bonnie Tyler and Jayne Child, and pretty much every other female singer from the 80s we like that most everyone under 25 has never heard of (sacrilage!). “I’m sort of a niche market,” Spence explains, “but I work all the time, even if sometimes I get paid in leftovers from the buffet”. Thank God Fran Eaton from Illinois Review isn’t attending these events, or poor Spence wouldn’t be paid at all.
We’ve known Spence for four years now, and K. and Panda have booked him for various events they’ve produced around town, so he’s a casual friend, but no one who’s ever been to Buzzquarters (Spence, alas, is an Obama cultist, which keeps him at the periphery of our little universe). K. actually went up to Spence to ask him to send us his new press kit, because a friend of K.’s is going to be having an event and K.’s talking her into an 80s theme, which would be perfect for some Gloria, Solitaire, and Self-Control action.
Out of the blue, Spence said, “I’ve always wanted to ask you this, but what nationality are you?”.
“American,” K. replied. “The best damn country that ever was or will be”.
“No, lookit your hair, eyes, and eyebrows, you have such dark features, you look Jewish. Or maybe Muslim. You look like you are from the Middle East”.
“And you’re way too old to be dressing up like Laura Branigan. Those aren’t crows’ feet anymore, baby, they’re full on emu at this point, and there isn’t enough botulism in the whole world that’s going to fix that”.
“Wow, kitty’s got claws tonight,” Spence jabbed back, “I just said that I thought you were Jewish this whole time or from somewhere in the Middle East because your hair is so dark. What’s wrong with that?”
Clearly, we love Israel almost as much as we love America, so there’s nothing wrong with being Jewish. But, when you are an American, and you were raised Roman Catholic, being called Jewish by some idiot in a bar is frustrating — because it’s not who you are, and some fool is trying to force this alternate racial identity on you.
For years, Robby’s sister Ann-Louise never understood why K. was bothered by people doing things like this. Ann-Louise has blonde hair, which she pays for at the salon. No one left alive knows what her real hair color is, but it’s cartoon yellow most days, so she never gets asked the “Nationality Question” garbage.
Well, a few years back Ann-Louise got a small part in one of those schlocky horror movies she does and the role required her to be raven-haired, so she walked around in Miami for four months of shooting with very dark hair. It’s the only thing that changed about her, except for the tan she got working in Florida.
So, almost on day one, the Miami locals started talking to her in Spanish exclusively. They just assumed she was some sort of Latina. Mexian men, in particular, got very aggressive with her, and there was one instance where a group of them wouldn’t leave her alone as she tried to get into her car, saying all sorts of clearly suggestive things to her (that she did not understand), and taking her silence in return as tacit encouragement to proceed their “courting”.
About midway through shooting her part, she told K. she finally understood why he hated this “Nationality Expert” garbage and why he didn’t like it when random strangers came up to him and asked if he was Jewish or Middle Eastern.
“These morons see dark hair and dark eyes, and maybe it’s because public schools are so bad, but they just think that’s license to come up to you and accuse you of being things that you are not. I have no idea why any of this matters to these clowns, but it’s so 1936 Stuttgart to walk up to someone and ask him if he’s Jewish, or to just point and say that he is. It’s so weird”.
It’s actually one of the things, besides being gay, that’s a wedge between K. and his family — all of whom are light-brown or blond-haired, and none of whom have particularly enjoyed having a dark-haired, dark-eyed, “f*ckng faggot” (to borrow IL GOP Chair Pat Brady’s term) in the family. “Must have been switched at birth” was the classic Cleveland comedy styling on this issue.
Spence is a nice person, and he’s a great Laura Branigan, but he’s an idiot.
He just kept at the “Nationality Expert” stuff until K. finally had to tell him that he was being offensive. Spence never graduated any college, from what we know, but he started on this litany of how the color of K.’s eyes meant he was part this, but the shape of his ears meant he was part that (Romulan, evidently), and the way his eyebrows raise wholly under their own power when he talks means he must be related to Groucho Marx somehow.
It was beyond absurd: like going to Granny Clampitt and having her doktor your illness away, using tricks and tips she learned from possums.
Chicago is a city chock-full of these self-edumacated, “learned”, armchair “Nationality Experts”.
About a week ago, Sebastian went out on another of those dates his friend the matchmaker sets him up on, because the lot of us are convinced it’s time he stops dating actor/model/barntenders/musicians and start meeting professional guys who are closer to all of us on the political spectrum too. So, the matchmaker sends him out with investment bankers, suite and tie somethings or another, or pharmaceutical reps…and while disaster doesn’t necessarily ensue, Bast will typically end up with whomever the new barback is on Halsted (insisting all the while he had nothing to do with it, and that “it just happened” because they asked him out, and he was powerless to say no).
The last guy the matchmaker sent him out with was nice enough, until he showed his “Nationality Expert” credentials and proved himself to be even more aggressive and in your face than Spence was with K.
What’s baffling to us is that these asses never realize they’re making their “Nationality Subject” uncomfortable with the interrogation. When this guy asked Bast the whole “Where’s your family from? No, before that. Where were they from before that too. What about before that, and then before that next batch, and before that too?” and Bast just kept saying he’s American, and his family is from America, and that if someone asked an Australian or a Canadian or a Mexican where they are from, and they said Australia, Canada, and Mexico respectively (and that would be an acceptable answer), this would be the end of it, the clown didn’t see he should back down with this crap already.
Instead, he took his hand out and clicked off all the things he “was”: Hungarian, British, Irish, Portuguese, Spanish, whatever. Never once mentioning “American”.
“So, you don’t live here then?,” Bast asked.
“No, I live in Chicago.”
“But, you weren’t born here?”
“Nope, born and raised in Chicago.”
“But, you’re not a Chicagoan, or an American. You are all those random things you needed your fingers to count. And you have pasta sauce all over your fingers, FYI. And you seem to have more ingredients in you than the sauce, yet here you are, oblivous to living in the greatest country in the world”.
Bast then went in for the kill and asked the clown if he knew the leaders of the countries he listed off, the ones he is “from”. He didn’t know any of them.
“Well, if you are a quarter Irish, you should at least be able to come up with some of the letters in the Irish prime minister’s name. Care to buy a vowel, or even tell me if it’s a man or a woman? Someone who needs to take his right paw out to click off all the things he “is” should know who’s running part of where he’s “from”, right?”.
To save the evening and end on a good note, Bast kept trying to use whatever opportunities the nationality questioning presented to segue into something about food, art, or music…but Nationality Expert wasn’t having any of it.
Our friend Althea once said we should answer this garbage by saying: “What nationality am I? I’m black. That makes me a big ole’ n*gger. Got a problem with that, honky?”. Because Althea thinks hitting these Liberals back with that is hilarious, and they’ll never ask someone this again. “Oh, then call them a racist because that will keep them up at night, and if you really want to get them, shout to other tables that there’s a racist in the room, but just make sure they paid the check first”.
It’s clear that the public school system is behind this here in Chicago, because that’s a common thread with all these clowns: they are all products of CPS, where evidently it is taught that being “American” is bad, and that everyone needs to be a mutt of some kind, comprised of all these quarters, fifths, sixths, and eleventy-eths of various European and exotic things.
It reminds us a lot of the story we were all taught in Catholic school about Peter being pressed to deny Christ three times before the cock crowed. Here K. and Bast (and Joaquin, to a much, much lesser extent) are, forever being pressed to deny their country…like Peter denied Christ.
“What are you?”
“American”.
BAM!
“What are you?”
“American”.
BAM! Unacceptable! You must be something foreign!
“What are you?”
“American”.
BAM! Not possible. For Liberalism’s cult to thrive we must divide people into as many separate compartments and boxes as possible. We must dilute the concept of an American identity and instead harken to nonsensical allegiances to failed European states, of which the Cult of Liberalism so greatly admires. You are not American. You are what we want you to be. You are what we say you are. You are Toby, not Kunta Kintae.
BAM! BAM! BAM!
Oh, we so totally went there. We invoked some Alex Haley up in here. Take that “Nationality Experts”.
Must be the soul in all of us that Althea keeps wanting us to bring to the table.
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The timing of this post is ironic. I’m from (and living again in) Cleveland, and last night I was at a party and the first question almost anyone asked was “Where did you go to High School.” As for people asking about ethnicity, if they don’t like the answer “American” and keep pressing, I just call myself a Euro-mutt (plus for some reason it really ticks them off).
Don’t they know there is life after high school??????
I guess if you really wanted to stop it cold you could answer:
“I do not know because I was adopted….” (By Mother America)
I was once asked, in a small town here in Wi., who are you from home? Had to think about that one for a second.
In NJ, the question is “You’re from Jersey? What Exit?”
OMG! That’s so funny. My mother was from NJ, and I remember thinking when people asked her that was is there only one damn road in the state?
LOL. That is too funny.
It’s the standard Jersey Joke.
It may be a joke, but it’s true.
In an unrelated matter, when I was in college, I spent a month in England. Although I got mistaken for German once, most of the English people I met said that they could tell at a glance that I was an America. My looks are sort of unremarkably Anglo, so I asked what tipped them off. They said it was easy to spot Americans because we had a fussy look about us and were concerned about little things like socks that matched our outfits. Apparently we amused them with our attention to detail.
Admittedly, this was a few years ago…
i grew up in nyc…the standard question was ‘do you live in the city’(manhatten)? the 4 other boroughs were chopped liver.
in nj, it is ‘what exit?’ referring to the garden state parkway which runs the length of the state. and you have to be careful, because the exits running south are not necessarily the exits running north. i found this out the hard way the first year i lived here.
In Cleveland the “What high school did you go to?” is the lazy way of placing you geographically and figuring out how old you are, and frequently serves as the launch point into “Were you the same year as Dan Murphy?” etc etc. If you say you went to Ignatius, you got yourself a solid hour of conversation – snap, just like that! For those of us who actually lived somewhere else in the world, it’s annoying and parochial but I’ve never found it to be actually hostile. You’re giving Cleveland a bad name, Boyz – here on the East side, we could really care less if you’re gay or not.
How does one “look” Jewish? Or “look” Muslim? Last I heard those are religions, not nationalities. Until Spence can accurately pick Baptists, Presbyterians and Catholics out of a crowd based on physical appearance and/or hair color, he’s just a bar dweeb trying to appear urbane and culturally sensitive. He loses on both counts.
Answer anybody: Honey, my mama is DAR.
I guess if you read judgement behind the question, I can see why it would bother you. I’ve a very mixed ancestry, look like I could be from any number of countries, and have lived outside the U.S. I’m proud to be American, but it’s never occurred to me to be offended by people inquiring about my heritage.
I think because the U.S. is such a mixed society, it’s just another way of people relating to one another and finding common ground. I think it’s interesting to hear how different cultures influence people, sometimes in ways they’re not aware of until they compare differing experiences.
Anyway, why take offense where none might be intended?
when in the USA I get asked what part of England I am from!!! I am Australian but of course I am part English, Irish, Scots and German.
Yeah, but were your family passengers or crew members of the boats taking the riff-raff from England to the penal colonies of Australia? LOL!
well, I always thought that my family was clear… until I decided to look up a name in the Irish transportation index… and well… er… um…it is like this… I discovered that there had been a marriage in Hobart Town in Van Diemans Land (Tasmania) in about 1853… the woman was Julia Whelan… and the man Peter Murphy….
Peter Murphy was the soldier… and that meant that Julia Whelan earned herself a one way ticket to Van Diemans Land (probably on one of the last convict ships to arrive) because she stole clothing!!
What a shock
and that was on my father’s side of the family 
My great-grandmother Anne was born in Sandhurst Army Barracks… Sandhurst is now known as Bendigo.
We found birth records for 3 other children: Margaret, John and Georgia.
That was a joke, of course.
Julia Whelan was from Queens County in Ulster… so yeah she is Irish riff raff ROFL
I thought Queen’s County was County Laois, in Leinster. (Unless you’re talking about something that was there in the 1850s, not now. In which case, boy do I feel silly.)
I get British and Australian mixed up sometimes…I don’t know why.
I grew up in St. Louis, which is also famous for the “where did you go to high school.” Most of the St. Louis area is not snobbish, and even though it has a population of over 2.5-3M people, it is incredible what a small place it is, so the question is a somewhat reliable 1st question.
We love you guys. But I miss the snark on Michelle’s wardrobe.
But many are…
I’m living there these days and I got that question a lot. My only answer is, “I’m not from here so that question doesn’t apply’.
To me I’ve always felt that it was a class/caste question. Tell me where you went to school so I can peg your family’s connections and income level.
As someone from the West Coast, where people will ask ‘what do you DO?’ it’s strange to me. I was a rarity, a California native, not a transplant. When you live in a densely populated area of transplants, no one asks where you went to school, unless you were directly out of college and it applied to your major. They ask what you do, and unless it’s really interesting or unusual, it’s sort of just an icebreaker.
I don’t find the majority of St Louisians ‘snobby’, but there is certainly an element of those who are and don’t even know it.
I also find the question exlusionary. Never fails to make one from the outside feel like they’re from the outside. I was literally steered away from the inner loop areas by our real estate agent specifically because transplants were ‘less accepted’.
STL is a great place and has a lot of great people here, but there are aspects of it that aren’t so appealing. It’s not a big enough deal for me to condemn the question, but I could see how it could affect it’s growth.
This is the opinion of someone who has been on the receiving end of that question. The locals think that it’s charming, as someone with the wrong answer, not so much. Btg, I have a very high social annoyance tolerance.
St Louis needs to grow instead of receding, but that question needs to be tempered here if that is going to happen.
JMO
I’m going to share my perspective on this topic which is a little different from the boyz, although I totally understand their frustrations…it DOES get old.
My dad is Portuguese. He was born in the US in Rhode Island, but moved back to Portugal as a child and was raised there until he came back to the US when he was 18. He learned English by working as an usher in a movie theater and watching the movies. Learned how to read English by just reading the newspaper every day. It blows my mind (especially after taking Spanish in High School and College) that he taught himself to read and write in English. It’s a hard language.
Anyway, growing up I had a different last name from my friends, but I grew up in Miami where Hispanic names were the norm. But my name was spelled a little differently than most, so I would often get asked what nationality it was. Being I kid, you take any opportunity you can get to sort of be different…well, at least I did, so I LOVED telling everyone I was half Portuguese. My Mom is one of the American mutts like you mention. It’s not that I didn’t love being an American but I was also really proud of all that my dad had accomplished. Not to mention in Miami we were getting the criminals that were sent by Castro as he emptied his overcrowded jails, bombarding our schools and neighborhoods. So I didn’t want to be put into THAT catagory. And I had a lot of friends that were from one of the many well-to-do folks that escaped Cuba after Castro’s revolution. Those were the people that built Miami and made it special and wonderful back in the 50′s. I felt bad for them because saying you were Cuban was becoming offensive at this time rather than honorable as it had been.
Anyway, the is a long and boring post saying that while I love being American, I also appreciate that part of being American is that we all came here from somewhere. It’s sort of fun to learn about your family story and here all that it took for your ancestors to come to the US and make there way. Usually those immigrants who came here way back when (legally of course) made sure their children knew how lucky they were to be here. How you can be whatever you want to be in the US and it was all about freedom and individual liberty.
Sometimes it seems the problems started the farther we got away from understanding what our ancestors did to get here. YOu can take it for granted ya know?
After saying all that, I will NEVER understand being rude and obviously combative when someone doesn’t give you the answer you expected. If you can’t understand when you’ve offended or bothered someone, you need to go to manners class. Just apologize and explain you didn’t mean to offend and move on to another topic.
And fwiw, I am a die hard Florida Gator fan…my first husband was a FL St Seminole. After our divorce, I swore I would never date another Seminole and I know it may sound shallow, but I never did. In the first few minutes of meeting my husband, I had to ask his college allegence…it is an important question for me. Thankfully, he was a Gator through and through and the rest is history.
Love to see you guys back!
Ugh…I normally really try to avoid making these kinds of comments but I just wrote a VERY long post about my perspective which I thought was a little different and it got sucked away in WordPress-land. Ugh.
Oh well, suffice it say my dad was born in the US but raised in Portugal. He learned to read and write English on his own and for most of my life I was always very proud of that Portugues heritage and joyfully talked about it whenever asked. My dad was also always one to tell us about the greatness of America and how lucky were are to live her.
Having said all that, I still think it’s just plain rude to keep being annoying and continue on a topic when it’s obvious the other person would rather not talk about it. Where do these guys learn about manners?
Rude to be insistent, I agree. Otherwise, every time I read these blogposts about the nationality experts, I just kind of wonder “what’s the bid deal”? It seems like the reactions are way out of proportion to the usual innocence of the question. I am never insulted by that type of question, so I guess that’s why I don’t see why it is such a big deal. And yes, I have dark hair, tanned dark skin, and dark eyes, and although not hispanic, people have assumed so, and have spoken to me in Spanish before even attempting to speak to me in English. In this area of Florida, there are people who actually don’t speak English, especially the closer you get to Tampa. Since I studied Spanish in middle school, and high school, I can at least communicate with them, albeit in a “broken” Spanish kind of way. I used to be pretty good at it, but I lose more and more of it every year.
Anyway, I shrug my shoulders to all of this, but everyone is free to choose how they react to nationality experts.
Italian, Polish, German, Hungarian here.
I just thought of something. One of the reasons people might have an interest in someone else’s ancestory may have to do with how recent one’s own family has been in this country. My great grandparents on both sides of the family were immigrants from Europe. One of my grandparents took pride in her knowledge of the Polish language. It made me realize about the differences that exist between Americans, and it actually caused me to wonder about other’s backgrounds.
Nomobama, I didn’t know you were in Florida too. I also have dark hair and dark eyes and most think I’m Italian or some other kind of Latin. I used to get approached by Spanish people as well, but it doesn’t happen as much. Probably because I’m often with my kids…3 of which are very fair skinned and non-Hispanic looking. The other one looks like a cross between an American Indian and a surfer chick.
I’m in Pasco County. When I was young, people thought that I was American Indian because at the time I had dark, shiney, straight hair. I took it as a compliment. When I first went to Middle School, one girl called me a “nigxer”, but some other girl ratted her out to the teacher. I was probably one of the darkest kids in school. I darken considerably in the summer, too. Anyway, I have seen many hispanics who are actually lighter than I am, with some who look very European with blond hair, and light eyes. Most do fit the dark hair, dark eyes mold, though. As a matter of fact, about three weeks ago I stopped at the Tampa Flea Market for the first time, and decided that I wanted some Spanish food. The girl at the counter did not speak one word of English, and she had blondish hair and blue eyes. Before I ordered, I asked her if she spoke English, and she indicated to me “no”. I then started speaking to her in Spanish, and I would ask her the Spanish words that I did not know. She was very obliging of me. She told me in Spanish that she was a boriqua… Puerto Rican. She did have an English speaking co-worker, though, but once she knew that I could speak some Spanish, that’s the way we communicated to each other. She liked that, and yes, she was surprised that I wasn’t hispanic.
As someone who has lived in several states and traveled a far amount since graduating from college, I will confess to asking people where they’re from strictly for the geographical info. I usually do this as a way to find some common ground and topic for finding out more of their interests. It’s also good for finding out interesting personal tidbits if they’ve moved or traveled some. I do however only try to ask people I’m pretty sure didn’t grow up in the general area of where we may be presently standing. Of course with the Southern accents down here in Louisiana, it’s a little easier to pick out the transplants like me to target for questioning! LOL Unless they beat me to it and ask me first!
I do the same thing! But more out of curiosity to learn something about their state or something unique to them. And it is a fantastic way to find great places to visit or sites to see.
It’s very common in Colorado (esp El Paso county which has a lot of military families) that you are originally from another state, so it is definitely not taken offensively when someone asks you where you are from orginally (always meant what state in the US).
And having gone to university at Valpo (lots of Chicaaaaagoland people go there), no matter where I am in the country, I can spot a damn Chicagoan a mile a way…Chicaaaaaago
Yes…military communities do ask for reasons of connecting. We’ve all lived in the same military communities and it is common to share those experiences.
Valpo? In Indiana? I lived there many years before coming back to GA.
Yep…that’s the one. You probably wouldn’t recognize the town any more. It’s almost a suburb of Chicaaaago now
When I’m asked that question, I always answer, “Montana”. When prevailed upon – “Where are your people from?” I say, “Butte”. That always gets the conversation going about this part of the country – and you wouldn’t believe the stupid things people say – LOL.
Well, I’m in Arizona, and I think the question gets asked a lot here just because there are so many people from other places who have migrated here. It is almost rare to find a born and raised Arizonan, so it’s almost like a quest…haven’t really paid attention to hair color and if those people get asked more than others.
I guess at the “old” age of 50, no one bothers asking me such loaded questions (because it would take too long to answer), although the Swiss can tell from my US-accented German that I am an American and sometimes ask to see if they are correct in their assumption. Sometimes they ask a follow-up question only because they want to know if you grew up in an area that they may have visited on holiday.
Depending on how the questions are asked, I am not too insulted by such questions. I think it’s the *bars* you are frequenting and the vapid poseurs that go there that lend themselves to such superficial nonsense. Have fun with it, but don’t read too much into it.
If “American” doesn’t shut down the whole line of questioning, I think the Boyz should answer “Klingon,” along with a few useful phrases in the Warrior Tongue. That should confuse the hell out of these people, and also bring home how ridiculous the whole question is.
ROFL. Great suggestion.
In the D.C. suburbs, they do not ask what high school. The question is “what school did you go to?” Everyone automatically answers their high school or private school. For university, they ask ” where did you get your degree?”
DC is a very intense place to live. I lived there in the 80s and early 90s and found it very stressful. Then I moved to Tennessee and it was actually startling how nice people were. And black people even TALKED to you. It took us a while to get over that.
It can be, but I have lived here many years and have the absolute best circle of friends I have ever had. But, it took time.
“Then I moved to Tennessee and it was actually startling how nice people were. And black people even TALKED to you. It took us a while to get over that.”
I’m on vacation in the South, and yesterday we got our car stuck in a flash flood and pushed out by the black people who lived nearby. They were happy to help us and didn’t have any “attitude” about it at all. Back at home, most of the black people I know have a sort of detached hostility towards white people, except the ones who are African immigrants.
Brilliant writing, Kevin!
Yup. When I was in the US, I kept getting people who heard the Irish accent and started off on the IRA and Sinn Féin and how awesome they thought Gerry Adams is. It was worse when it was guys trying to hit on me.
And if *I* tried to explain my own culture, like how we don’t actually want Northern Ireland, I kept on getting corrected and told that I must be a Protestant (which I am, but it’s irrelevent) and not really Irish, not “ethnically”, and what I’m saying isn’t true. It’s the worst in areas with high proportions of Irish Americans. Never happened in the “redneck” states, where the most I got was “yer accent is kee-yoot”.
I’ve never understood the American obsession with this. I don’t ramble on constantly about my German ancestors. I’m Irish. That’s it.
You’re so right…it really is all about dividing people up.
I gotta say where I live you’re going to stand out if you’re not white. There are very few “other” nationalities in my little town. Which there is nothing wrong with that. I’ve lived in the big cities and lived the racial divide (Washington DC) and I’ve lived in a foreign country where I was the minority (Japan). My kids do not see race. You could be blue and they would not notice and they think it’s annoying when people do talk about race.
Interestingly, my daughter loves all things Asian (speaks Japanese and is learning to write) which is a very, very protective culture (for good reason). I think it’s good to learn about people but not for the purposes of dividing people. Politicians want voting blocks. That’s not appreciation. That’s using people.
When I was on a cruise, a Chilean man told me I didn’t look American. I asked him what an American looks like and he couldn’t explain.
Boyz,
This is a GREAT post. I guess these “nationality experts” would like me a lot because “my ancestors” (lifting my nose up) came from the “elite” country of Great Britain, AND I am a Mayflower descendant. But, these Pilgrims were not upper class and were persecuted for their beliefs, so maybe these “nationality experts” wouldn’t like me.
My English ancestors (nose a little higher) settled Hartford.
As a Christian, I love Israel, BUT, I’ve got some German blood in me, so does that mean I don’t REALLY love the Jews? (Hang head in shame.)
I’ve been to a couple of the “ia” countries in my youth – Romania & Yugoslavia, so does this mean I’m tainted? I’ve maintained a 37 year long relationship with a Romanian and he now lives in the U.S. AND he just became an American citizen, so do I gain or lose points for this? I also went to the “fancy white” countries of Switzerland and Austria. Can I put my nose in the air again?
I’m often told that I “look French,” but my dear, departed father would roll over in his grave if he heard that because he thought the country was filled with whores. This idea must have come from his WWII experience. I’m sure HE would not think of France as an “elite” country. (Please forgive me, if you are of French descent.)
I LOVE how you have highlighted and pressed this issue for some time now. I’m sure that there are many of us here who have, at one time or another, not thought of ourselves immediately as Americans. Thank you for adjusting our thinking on this. While I have been guilty of thinking of myself as “three-quarters English and one-quarter German,” I only think of myself as American these days. THANK YOU, Boyz.
“I’m sure HE would not think of France as an “elite” country.”
I think what the Boyz are describing is a form of intra racial competition. It’s about gaining socio-economic status over other whites, and proving ethnic authenticity.
Has anyone else noticed the white leftist American obsession with proving that they are not simply Americans? That they are “Europeans” of some kind, that they are whiter than the whites who see themselves as simply Americans? (Yes, I know there are non white Europeans. I’m talking about popular perceptions.)
So France is seen as an elite country because it’s comparatively rare in the US, and they can set themselves up as white, upper class Europeans – better than the “white trash”. This wouldn’t be possible with someting like Spanish or German, which have more potential speakers and a wider spectrum of social classes.
Look at the cultural obsession with soccer every time the World Cup comes round. White conservatives who like soccer just like soccer. White lefties who like it see it as a part of their identity.
The only reason I ask is because I have an interest in genealogy. Don’t care where people are from, I just find it interesting. And there are many people like CTmom with all kinds of roots. I am German/Polish, but my nieces ancestry cuts a swathe through the whole of Europe with my BILs heritage.
Good to have the Boyz back. Missed your writing, but know you needed a break too. Looking forward to comments on the Queen and her travels.
The nationality questions reminds me of a time my teen aged daughter was paying for gas at the local station. She is petite, blue eyed, red haired, but she tans and gets a goodly amount of attention from guys. The station owners and all employees are middle eastern of some type ( yeah, don’t call me racist, we still shop there!)Anyway, one of the workers kept asking my daughter, “What are you?” She kept asking what he meant. Her answer,
“Umm, American” The funny thing was an older man behind her said “DAMN STRAIGHT AND DON’T YOU FORGET IT!”. We still laugh about that one.
I think we have some genealogy fans here! My family on my mother’s side are originally from Scotland (Ross), and England (Hurd, maybe Wales, I’m not sure). Anyway, both sides were here before the American Revolution. The Rosses fought for the crown, so they were sent to Canada (empire loyalists). My dad’s family (Ziegle and Syfert) are from Germany (Bavaria and Alsace), but before the Civil War, settling in Cincinnati and Peoria, IL.
By the way, whenever I hear that whites are racist, I always say to myself, three of my four great grandfathers fought in the union army to abolish slavery. They put their lives on the line.
I’m from Minnesota, so when I meet a “transplant”, especially from some warmer place, I like to ask what brought them here, what do they miss most from home or what has surprised you most about our state? It makes for a fun conversation.
My parents are from the Midwest, my siblings were born all over the country, I was born in CA. My ancestors were Polish. When I was young and a tow head, I was often asked if I was Scandinavian.
That being said, so what. It’s sort of a boring icebreaker, and if someone were insistant, I would wonder why they were being pushy.
Am I wrong, or is this too casual for being presidential?
http://www.whitehousedossier.com/2010/08/14/obama-golfing-panama-city/
So what else is new? Again, MO looks like she threw on the first thing she pulled out the drawer, BO looks like the second coming of Urkle.
My 4-year-old nephew and I just yesterday were sitting together, resting from a rather long tricycle ride and he turned to me and asked me, “Where are you from?” As I stared at him in confusion and before I could process an answer, he suggested, “Walmart?”
What are you?
I might come back with cyborg.
“a white person who is “from” anywhere Mediterranian that’s not Italy”
That’s news to me. Italy’s ground zero for “dark enough to look down on but white enough to not get called a racist for it” in my dago book.
GOOD GRIEF! There’s ‘ignorant’ and then there’s ‘IGNORANT’!
The one thing I hate the most about nationality experts is how they tell you of different traditions and experiences they have had in “your” country.
This is f-ing hilarious when they start telling this to my husband. His family can track their ancestors to 1910 in Pearsall, TX. They have never been to Mexico nor have any family in Mexico. So calling them Mexican is irritating.
The other most irritating assumption from liberals and nationality experts is that my husband must be offended by the lack of a comprehensive immigration policy. LOL.
One other thing…living in Florida it is more rare than normal to find that your immediately family is actually FROM Florida. People often ask down here where you’re from because there are so many tourists and many snowbirds who are from the north and only come down here in the winter. When people found out I was born here, only lived about 2 years outside of the state when I was little, my mom has lived her since she was a teenager and even some grandparents lived most of their lives here, it’s very odd. Probably another reason why it doesn’t shock me when people ask where I’m from.
I get asked the nationality question all the time! I have (naturally) dark hair and dark eyes with beyond pale skin. No one ever gets it right. And it is super annoying. Particularly when people just call me a silly white girl who can’t possibly understand the plight of illegals. Then, with a smile on my face and a song in my heart, I gladly tell them my obviously Hispanic last name and emphasize that my family came here legally.
Maybe I have been doing things wrong, but I ask where someone is from because I have been to so many places, I may know that area. If I meet a Korean, I can say hello and thank in Korean, same with Turkish and Japanese. I don’t mean any disrespect when I ask. As for the U.S., I have been in every state except the NE. I would like to go up there sometime too.
So, if I have met any of you and you were insulted because I asked about your family background, I’m sorry. I will stop doing that.
I thought most people were pleased that I was interested though. I guess I was wrong.
Speaking of Kunta Kinte, you guys know “Roots” was a plagiarized fraud, right? Even Henry Louis Gates acknowledges it and has said people should be candid about it, which really surprises me.
http://www.martinlutherking.org/roots.html